Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Welcome because you are now listening to from the CART Pass with your host Trent Roberts, bringing you tips, support and.
[00:00:12] Speaker B: Player recognition and education with the experts for parents and junior golfers in Indiana.
[00:00:21] Speaker A: This is from the CART Path with.
[00:00:23] Speaker B: Your host, Trent Roberts.
[00:00:25] Speaker C: Foreign.
I've had a few people reach out to me to find out what was my favorite episode of 2025, and I immediately went to the first half of the Girls High School State Championship preview when Albert Jennings, a Ball State alum and instructor up in Fort Wayne, joined us with Nate McClung, Yorktown High School Boys and Girls Head Coach.
And one of the great things from that conversation was you just sat there and were amazed by the wisdoms that Albert put out there.
And it reminded me of when I read some of my Stoicism books, as you can see one back here, Life of the Stoics and the Great Greek Philosophers. And for those that aren't aware, a Stoic was a member of an originally Greek school of philosophy believing that God determined everything for the best and that virtue is sufficient for happiness.
Its later Roman form advocated the calm acceptance of all occurrences as the unavoidable result of divine will or the natural order.
Over the course of the next 30 minutes, Albert provides us with I believe he is a philosopher of golf and his laid back approach to the game and understanding of everyone around it and how important it is for all of us to prepare for tournaments and the reason why this conversation was so great.
There are several moments in that that you're going to get to listen to here and him talking about many different things that not just players need to do to prepare for a tournament.
Also, what parents need to do to prepare for a tournament and how we act on the course and how we respond to our players is critical to their game.
And I hope you get as much enjoyment out of my conversation as Nate and myself did during this great conversation with Albert. I hope to have Albert on many more times, but for my listeners that did not listen to that episode, I want you to listen to this 30 minute discussion and we left out talking about the course and all that other stuff, but listen to us talk about preparation and the mental side of the game and reality is there's just a lot that went on the conversation that I love listening to that particular episode because I keep learning from it as I listen to it more. I hope you enjoy it.
We are continuing our IHSAA State Championship week with our third podcast of the week and I'm excited because we get to do a couple of things tonight we have a guest with us, a great instructor out of Fort Wayne, Indiana at Brookwood Golf Club, Albert Jennings, a Ball state grad of 2016, which you get close to that 10 year reunion, Albert. And we have again with us Nate McClung. And we're going to have some conversations with Albert and then we're going to have a little preview of the course and then we're going to kind of go into and talking about teams and expectations and getting prepared and talking about some of the players we all want to see this weekend. So. So, Albert, how does it feel to see the success of your girl so far during the state? You have two sectional, excuse me, you have some sectional champs and then you have regional champs and you have a couple of regional runner ups. What's that as an instructor feel like?
[00:04:18] Speaker A: Well, I'm happy for the girls. You know, first and foremost, I try not to focus on winning. I think as a camp we try not to focus on winning, but doing the work, trying to show up the best we can on the day. I'm always curious as a coach, you know, how does our stuff compare to other people's stuff? And you know, because at the end of the day this is a competitive thing and it, you know, to win a golf tournament, you've got to beat everybody. And if I think that I'm any good, then when we go to a tournament, our stuff should stack up pretty good. And you know, when it doesn't, I learn something and look for some of those holes and what we could have done better. But you know, I would say that a lot of our girls did a really good job in prep getting ready for their, you know, regional events. And we never look past a regional, but we do always keep it in perspective in terms of, hey, state's going to get a little further, it's going to be a little different challenge. So in that lead up, you know, I'm kind of half thinking about the regional, but also half thinking about the turnaround for state, especially for, you know, those high level players that I think could, could compete at the top of the leaderboard.
But it was awesome. It was a fun regional week.
We'll have seven girls that will play at state.
I believe that's a record for me.
But I'm super stoked. I had a couple players that, you know, had to make sure that they were in the lineup. A freshman that was in and out of the lineup all year and was able to come up with her best stuff at regional.
I'm very comfortable actually saying who that was Brittany Irving.
Just did an incredible job.
I got to see one of the biggest smiles on her face when she found out what she shot. And she got into a really great flow state where she wasn't really thinking about score and had, you know, really, her best round of the year. Genuinely almost cried just seeing her face when I, hey, great job. And the smile comes across her face. And so to see. I've said this before, but, you know, one of the reasons that I do what I do is because I like seeing young people achieve something that they maybe didn't know was possible for them just yet. And so when I get to witness those moments, that's really special for me. So of all the, you know, wins and, you know, some people breaking par and that sort of thing, you know, one of my favorite rounds of regional was Brittany Irving's mid-80s score. That was her best of the year. And she's a freshman and growing and doing awesome. So, yeah, long way of saying I'm really excited about the seven who are there and really excited about what we did at the regional, you know, as a group. And again, curious to see how it stacks up with everybody else's stuff, all the great instructors and players, you know, across the state, you know, that's what we're trying to be in that category. And so weeks like this, where we all get to kind of come together and see what happens on these two days, which is largely random, you know, somebody's going to have a good weekend and win.
It's going to be within a group of people that have worked really hard, but who that individual person is, who can know. So, you know, I love my girls. Super proud of what they've done leading up to now. And so anything else is just gravy.
[00:07:26] Speaker C: So, you know, one of the reasons when we made a move to you, Albert and I know, we had several conversations. And so everyone knows in the audience, Albert is Sophie's instructor. And I want to make. I want to make sure people understand that. And one of the reasons why we made the move to Albert was kind of the conversation we're getting to go to next is Albert is a.
He studies.
He gets to know not just his students, but he reads a lot of parental book. Parental books is what he has told me to understand how to work with the players to every kid's different, if that's the best way of putting it. And knowing how to work with each student that he has because of that skill he has built.
I kind of leads into my question of parents for this weekend. If you're kind of a parent to these seven girls that you're gonna have playing this weekend, what's it mean for parents? And kind of take me through your thought process there.
[00:08:24] Speaker A: So, you know, when I first got out of college and was coaching, admittedly, I didn't have as much empathy for parents as I do now.
I'm not a parent, but I almost exclusively am talking to parents.
And, you know, I appreciate so much just your jobs and the fact that you, you know, you create this person.
It's your job to keep them safe, and it's your job to set them up for, you know, a nice life where they can have some autonomy and they can accomplish things and feel good about themselves. And then, you know, one day they start to kind of talk back and not listen to you and, you know, want to hang out with other people.
[00:09:09] Speaker C: And that's at three years old, Albert.
[00:09:11] Speaker A: Right.
And so I understand how hard it is for parents. And emotionally, you're very, very involved, and it's very difficult to not be. But when it comes to these big weekends and these big moments, we're asking the kids to step up and maybe be a little bit bigger than themselves or be a little bit better than what they've been in the past. And I think that the same should be expected from coaches and parents. I think we should hold ourselves to the same standard.
And so to be kind of specific about that, right? So if I give a lesson to a player on Monday and they have a tournament, you know, Friday, Saturday, if they leave the lesson, just striping it, hitting it, great, there's going to be a few things that could get in the way between them showing up their best one is going to be the last 36 hours. So if we're talking state pretty much right now, how did we sleep two nights before? How did we sleep the night of? How did we eat? How did we drink?
What did we do for practice?
That second thing I'm curious about is that last hour, hour and a half. What did I do on the range? How did I get myself kind of locked in?
What did I think about? What did I listen to? What did I imagine?
And then that last piece is before every single shot, that last minute.
What do I do in the last minute to cue myself in to be my best?
I think parents often skip over some of that prep, mentally, emotionally sort of thing. I've told a few players this week when I was in high school, tournament week.
I'm wanting to do things that make me happy. I Want to eat things that make me happy. I'm going to watch TV shows and movies that make me happy. I'm going to do things that lower my levels and make it easier for me to regulate myself. I wasn't thinking that way when I was a kid, but effectively that's what, you know, I was doing.
And so for parents, I would really, really recommend and states coming up. But in the future, that week before, those days before, really think about how you want to show up and what things you can do for yourself. I mean, legitimately, go get a massage. Legitimately go do something fun for you. Because if you're like kind of on your kid and you're stressed and you're up here all week, that's going to feed into them. And then when you get out on the course, the actual day of, it's gonna be really hard for you to regulate.
Same thing for that last hour before.
Are you talking to other parents and talking about outcomes or ruminating in your own head about what's gonna happen? That's not gonna help you show up your best. And ultimately, I think that the most important thing a parent can do, just like a player, is control those 60 seconds before and those 30 seconds after.
Kids, even kids that are really autonomous, really do it for themselves.
They don't feel like they get pressure from their parents. Even those kids. It's natural to look over at your parent and see what they thought.
If you're having these reactions, body language, if they can hear you, even if you didn't say anything negative, if they hear your voice. And dads, your voices carry more than what you think it's going to take them away from what they should be thinking about.
That's them for you. It's just going to raise your stress levels all day. There's. You guys probably know this.
Some of the younger people listening to might not. There's that playoff game where Reggie Miller against the Bulls hits the three. Last second. There's maybe less than a second left, but enough to take a shot. Reggie Miller's jumping up and down.
Everybody's elated. The camera cuts to Larry Bird and he looks like he's sitting in traffic.
He's kind of chewing his gum and he's just looking straight ahead. He was asked about it after. He said, well, Michael Jordan's on the other team, so we've gotta, you know. And I think with golf, I think it's similar where any individual thing that happens, just take 10 seconds before a reaction.
Because once that reaction starts again, just like I tell my players, once that reaction starts, your heart rate's up, chemicals start going in your body that are not used to regulate. They're used to, you know, run away from a bear.
Let's see if we can calm those down by taking, you know, that last minute before to pre accept. Hey, she might miss this. Hey, this is a tough hole. If we come away with part here, that'd be awesome. If it's a bogey, no big deal. Say that to yourself beforehand because then you'll be able to show up in a little bit more regulated way when it doesn't go.
[00:13:49] Speaker C: And that takes time.
Nate, you. I don't know if you saw me that much. This past weekend, HSC was paired with Yorktown Albert. And so obviously he, one of his number two, got to play with with Sophie. And there was a couple times on the course that day where kind of what you're talking about, one side of it which was not good, and one side of it which was what you just said about the bogey, if it's going to happen and move on.
Nate, hole 14, the maintenance shed at Edgewood.
And when I saw Sophie put her iron back in her bag and pull out her five wood, I start pacing back and forth over back in the rough. I'm like, we are too under par. What are we doing? What's happening here? I'm walking back and forth, and one of the girls on her team goes.
She hit that in the practice round the other day and put it five feet in front of the green. Gut up and down for birdie. Why are you stressed now? Look, I'm like, she was right.
Number one. She was right. She knew what she was doing. She was in the moment. It was her decision and not mine. And I'm just a stressed out parent because I want what's best for them, but I needed at that moment to hear that, to be able to set myself back and relax.
And then we got to hole seven, hole 16.
She had a shot that went left, and it was going to be a tough chip.
And I went in and said, you know what? She's three under. We've got 17 and 18 coming up that she can birdie. Bogey's gonna be fine here.
Whatever happens, happens. And she had a great chip. I think she talked to you about this, Albert. She had an amazing chip. I didn't even know how she hit it. And Mr. Putt got her bogey, but nobody was bothered because I think she knew and we knew that she could birdie the next two holes. Which is what was accomplished. And I think what you said earlier about parents being able to accept and move on and not be stressed about it, you gotta be able to tell yourself it's okay. There's. Over the next two days at State, I'd said this to the freshman girls. There's gonna be 150 shots for some of you or less. Some of you a little bit more. And, Albert, you know that group I talked to? I'm exactly right about that number. And there's gonna be a percentage of shots that aren't great, but it's the recovery, and all of them can do it. It's just. You don't need to worry about it because we're not gonna hit every shot perfect. It's. It's that next one. And I think it's the same thing as a parent. It's accepting. And I think you were dead right on that. Nate, you have any thoughts on that as a coach?
[00:16:15] Speaker B: Yeah, a little bit, actually. I. I was taking some notes. First of all, I'm just humbled to be talking golf with Albert. I've heard Albert talk golf, and I. I have a question I want to ask later when we talk about the golf course. But this discussion, I think, is perfect because as a coach, I'm trying to keep the parents on the cart path, ironically. But we do talk a lot to our parents because they feel like they have no control. And often there' conversation where it's so stressful being a golf parent because you have no control. But I think what Albert just got into about those 60 seconds prior and 30 seconds after. That's why every time I'm around Albert, I learn something. So I think this discussion is just absolutely perfect because we have a coach, a swing coach, and a parent who's getting ready to go through that exact thing this weekend.
So I think that's just tremendous stuff there. Albert, I would just add that, that you're not a parent, but I have seen you out on these golf courses walking with. With the parents of all these girls. And just props to you, because you go beyond the expectations of swing coaches. You're out. You're walking the golf course. And I think it's tremendous what you said about the young lady you coached. Like, you get emotional when they have success, and that's the same thing we do as parents, man. So just keep doing what you're doing. I'm excited to see you this weekend, but I think. I think what you said about the 60 seconds before and the 30 seconds after for parents I'D never really heard it said that way. You know, we talk to our athletes that. But I think that's such just wonderful advice for what the 108 groups of parents that are going to be on the golf course this weekend. Because Prairie View, to use your words, is a different challenge. And the parents are going to need everything they can to try to regulate that stress and try to combat, as you said, getting all up in your feelings or however that was worded just a moment ago. Trent, I'm enjoying listening to this conversation.
[00:18:00] Speaker C: Well, and I think one of the things, too is there's so many different styles and types of courses that these young ladies play at sectionals than at regionals, where we know some of these sectional courses are not difficult.
So expectations are then set by a parent on how they perform at one of those events, whether it's sectionals or regional sometimes. And I don't want to go into naming courses or players or anything because I don't think that's fair. But there are courses that are a little bit easier at sectionals and some regional courses that are harder than others.
And I think sometimes then expectations are set, Nate and you've seen this probably with players and parents, they go to that next tournament where the light switch comes on even a little bit more because some kids haven't played as as many events as others.
Regionals is a big step up for a lot of players. That light switch is a little bit bigger. But parents somehow set this expectation, from what I've seen that, well, if my daughter shot this at sectionals, why isn't she shooting this at regionals? And I think that's the first mistake as parents that we can make is there's no expectations. And I think my expectations that I have set forth and it took me a long time to get here, and I think sometimes the wisdoms I get from Albert and some of our great conversations that we've had over the last six months is for me, my job's to be a dad.
My job's to be a supportive smile, not give her that negative energy that I probably did a year ago or two years ago when there was a bad shot or something. So I think there's no expectations for me. My expectations are what Sal talked about in our podcast, Nate, the enjoy part. I want to make sure my kids enjoying yourself out there, that's more important to me than anything else because if she doesn't enjoy herself out there and as a parent, what are we doing?
And that's kind of where I'VE gotten lately. So if she goes out there and doesn't shoot what she expects, I'm still gonna love her. I just hope she enjoys herself, because that's more important to me. And that's one of the things I've learned recently, Nate. And I think that's kind of where Albert's getting at with me on some things, is enjoy it. Enjoy the moment, because I've got less than two years at this point before she's off to school. Yeah.
[00:20:19] Speaker B: Trent, I think you and I think had this conversation, maybe even in person. But in what other sport?
Albert gave the Reggie Miller example. In what other sport do we tee it up? And we anticipate every time we play we're setting a new career high? It just. It. That's not the way that other sports work. So I think we do have, and I think largely parents are wonderful. But I think when you have some success, especially at the regional level, whatever that number may be, maybe it's Albert's player who just shot 85. Now all of a sudden you think, oh, my gosh, I'm going to shoot 80. And that's just not the way that golf works. I think for me, it's, how do we get you into a tighter range of scores? So say your ceiling is 82. Like, I want you to shoot a more consistent score. It's just not realistic that every time you play, you're going to shoot a career low. So I think it's a. It's a different skill set to be able to play with expectations. And I think Alberta certainly coaches some good players. Could talk more to that. But just regarding parent expectations, I think that's another thing we need to keep in mind for the discussion as well.
[00:21:20] Speaker A: And to add on to really what you both said in terms of the course.
And, you know, Nate, it's a great example, you know, with basketball and setting a career high every time you go out. I think that a lot of parents and players need to understand something about these courses.
If it were basketball, the difference between most sectional and regional courses and the state course would be okay, my daughter's shooting 40% from three, and the average person guarding her is five, eight.
At the state finals, that person's three.
You're going to be shooting over someone who's six three.
And also the rim is now 12ft.
And that sounds extreme for basketball. That is as extreme as it is in golf. When we go from 5,000 yards to 5,800 yards, a major thing happens for these girls.
There are girls that can hit it 240 yards, but only carry it at about 200.
And at that 200 number, that tee shot on one is going to look a little scarier because it's about 190 to cover.
And if my ball's coming in kind of flat. Cause it's used to kind of running out now, that's a much more difficult shot. There's a few other places on the course where if you can't carry it up over 200, it may be a little bit more of a difficult shot.
Additionally, even on the fairways that are, you know, nice and wide, you can hit your shot there, you're going to be hitting an 8 iron instead of a pitching wedge. That dispersion gets bigger. Whether you're Rory or the five player from such and such school, the longer the club, the bigger that dispersion gets. So when you watch your kids and you're comparing to scores that they've been shooting, you have to understand that the hoop is higher this weekend.
The pressure's bigger. That's where, you know, kind of the defender comes in.
But just by the numbers, they're going to shoot higher. Most of the players in the field now, there's a handful of players probably around 10% of the field that hit really hard and really high. They're gonna be in heaven in terms of the course setup. But even for them, they're gonna be switching from hitting a bunch of wedges and chip shots into these holes to now hitting middle and longer irons. Those chips now, when you do miss the green, just are a little further away. So that little bump and run now is a little delicate pitch that I gotta land on the fringe. These shots are difficult, and you haven't been getting as many reps.
And so that is something that has to adjust our expectations for us. And I think that golf parents especially, can learn from other sports. And maybe you've been this way in other sports.
Parents are very. They'll readily say, oh, yeah, they played soccer, but they just. They weren't fast enough.
They were playing basketball, but they're too short.
But then expect them to just overcome all these physical obstacles. In golf, like, it's hard.
[00:24:31] Speaker C: Who.
[00:24:31] Speaker A: Sure, it's getting really difficult.
So I would just say that, you know, understand and appreciate the challenge. You know, sometimes, especially when my players are on really difficult courses, one of the first things that I'll say to them is, tough out there, wasn't it?
And that will lead them to say, well, yeah, but I could have done this. This. This this, this. If I or a parent comes to them right after and like, you should have done this, this, this, this, this, then they're going to go the other way to where like, well, you don't get it. You blah, blah, blah. Maybe they're saying that, maybe they're thinking it. But if we can acknowledge for them, like, what the difficulty is and then let them critique what they want to critique, that's a healthier place to start from. But it starts with our recognition of the challenge.
[00:25:13] Speaker C: I just want to point out, you can tell we're all from Indiana when we're using basketball as our analogies for golf.
Because the whole time you're sitting there talking about Albert. I, I used this one the other day of the scene in Hoosiers where Hickory walks into Hinkle Field House and they're measuring the goal and they're going down and you're looking around and you're looking at the stadium around you. I was telling, like, you're over at. You're either over Edgewood or you're over at.
[00:25:39] Speaker A: Right.
[00:25:40] Speaker C: And then you, you go shoot. You go play Edgewood. And it's, it's, it's Hickory's gym. It's small, right? It's all together. You're wearing hard hats when you get, when you people are hitting shots because you don't want to get hit in the head. Right, Nate? And yeah.
And then you pull up to Prairie View and here's this huge stadium and it's just different. And it automatically smacks you right when you see it. Of, we're not in a small town course anymore. And I think that's what you're saying earlier, Albert, is the challenge and setting expectations as a parent, knowing, hey, be proud, number one, they made it here, they got to state. That's. That's awesome to begin with for a lot of these players across the state. I look at Bar Reeve down in Southern Indiana, I think this is the first time the school's ever made it to the state championship.
[00:26:34] Speaker B: That's correct.
[00:26:34] Speaker C: And then you have Allie Lewis from. I forget what school she's from that got out of the Lafayette Regional. It's a first time anyone from her high school is made to the state championship. I look at those moments as. Those are some of the cool moments that we don't sit here and think about because we're used to Northridge making it to state all the time lately. We know Taylor Larkins is going to be at state. We know HSC is going to be there. We know Zionsville is going to be back there. Heck Zionsville Nobles. Okay. Said two teams of state if they wanted to. We know those things are going to take place. But take pride in what we're seeing as well. As parents of. Look at all these awesome kids that are here with your child.
Enjoy that because this is an awesome moment.
[00:27:16] Speaker B: Ali Lewis, Western Boone.
[00:27:18] Speaker C: Yeah, there you go.
One of those Western schools. So that's kind of my thought there. Any more last words of wisdom for parents, Albert, before we start talking about the course?
[00:27:29] Speaker A: You know, just to kind of recap and reiterate and partially what you said, the enjoyment part.
And, you know, we don't. It's cliche. We just don't get time back.
And, you know, I go back and look at old pictures and, you know, I've been going to the state finals since maybe 20, 2018 with, with girls. And it's, it's a really special time for them, and it's, it's a time that they're going to remember. They're going to remember it one way or the other.
So the golf part we cannot control, but how we show up for them as the adults in their life that we can control. And we talk to kids all the time again about the mental side of controlling the controllables.
Are we doing that as parents and coaches, especially as it relates to making it as good and enjoyable of an experience as it can. And sometimes if they have a bad day, there's nothing you can do or say other than just be there, but they remember that, too. And if it's silence for a few hours and a nice text at the end of the day, maybe that's all that it is. But I think if, if every adult shows up this weekend and says, how can I help?
And, and if you can't help, if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all.
[00:28:53] Speaker C: Right.
[00:28:54] Speaker A: But I think for most of us, it's well within our power to be a positive, you know, force and, and support these kids because what they're doing is really, really hard.
And it's, for some of them, the biggest thing in their life. You know, I say to parents a lot, like, how do you feel when you have to give a big presentation or you have to. Yeah, this is how they're feeling, and they don't have all the life experience and skills to deal with it that, that, that we have. So, you know, I think my guiding light often is just to treat these kids with respect and treat them like, you know, adults in the way that I would want to be treated and respect what they're going through. And I think if you start from there versus, like a competitive place, like, you're going to be in a good spot.
[00:29:39] Speaker C: 100% agree. I was just sitting here thinking about a parent that I want to be this weekend and Presley Whitestad. Ryan. Ryan White.
Ryan will walk around the golf course and he's the happiest man on the golf course because his daughter's playing golf and he gets to watch. And I remember there was a tournament, she was struggling. He goes, you know, she's struggling, but you know how awesome it is that we're here. I really like watching your daughter play. This is awesome, isn't it? Aren't you so excited for them? And I'm sitting there like, that's how we need to be. Not my kids struggling. They'd never play like this.
That only feeds into the energy that you're giving off. And I think that's where I want to be. More like Ryan White, Presley's dad from Noblesville this weekend.
[00:30:26] Speaker A: Thanks for listening to this episode of from the Card Path with your host, Trent Roberts.
Please be sure to like and subscribe on your favorite podcast platform so that you never miss an episode.
